Forza vs Gran Turismo 7 is

Gran Turismo vs Forza has been a fight that has lasted since 2005. Since then Forza and Gran Turismo have traded blows, with many arguing the supremacy of one over the other. 

The new generation of these games are out, so I want to give my 2 cents on the current state of the battle. 

But before going there, this video is not to humiliate a side, but merely to show what I think of both titles. Im aware that Forza was released not long ago so it wont have the same level of updates. I paid full price for both titles, so, if you feel insulted about something, remember, its all in your head. 

Despite being both car collecting and racing games, they couldnt be more different titles.

As a series, Gran Turismo has always been eclectic. The history and stories of racing have always been front and center, all through the lens and tastes of Kazunori Yamauchi had for the time. 1 through 4, were really centered around car culture with plenty of homages to real racing, 5 and 6 brought racing figures like Ayrton Senna, or historic cars like the moon lander. 7 it seems to me to have followed a change in tastes of a more mature Kazunori. That is very visible at the Café. The café visually shows itself as a very upmarket experience, something for the car connoisseur. That is further presented by something that I consider is one of the big shifts not only in tone but also in terms of game structure. The Menus.

The Menu books are front and center as the way to progress. The tone is a bit too mature s every single time a Menu is unlocked or finished a story about a brand or a car comes out like they are describing the growing season of a wine grape. It can be interesting, Im saying it can be interesting because while the stories behind a Porsche or a Ford GT can be interesting from a car enthusiast perspective, Im not too sold on the value of menus for cars like the Prius. The menus also get old really fast. While pursuing the menu races, its possible to see something else that also becomes really old really fast. What doesnt become old is subscribing to the channel.The car collecting XP becomes a way to unlock car tuningparts from the store, or parts of the gameplay like online, and certain races. 

Forza presentation is far more bare-bones. A lot of the menus are simplified and straightforward, a bit too much really. The presentation, much like other forzas from the past, bar when they had the three bo’om gear guys , is straight to the point. At times, considering the amount of history cars and brands have, it becomes a little bit sad. In terms of events, Forza doesnt have anywhere as close in terms of variety of races, or types of event. In reality, this is a huge disappointment at this time. Its about 40 races in total, and thats about it. Theres really no feeling of opening up the game, or progressing through different modes of playing. 

The car progression is hugely different as well, as it tied to car XP to unlock car parts, rather than unlocking everything else in the game. This progression does take quite a bit per car, so it means every car is lockers behind at least a hour of gameplay. It was so bad before update 1, that the best way to progress was NOT to play the game by leaving every aid on and letting the car you want to upgrade doing the driving by itself. It is still a problem, but not as much now. 

Lets talk about content. Gran Tuismo offers 38 tracks with 81 layout and 118 possible configurations. In terms of cars we are talking about 491 cars. The tracks are a mix between real tracks and old ones.

Sadly, some of the previous real life tracks from 5 and 6 are not present, like Silverstone, Cote Dazur or Indianapolis are not present. What should be present is subscribing to the channel. 

The car selection is wide, but sometimes incomplete. We have many types of cars, JDM heroes, newly launched cars, excellent vintage cars like the Mclaren F1. Theres a bit for everybody. Some of the car choices come from Gran Turismo 5. Cars like the Megane RS or Polo GTI havent been updated to the newest generation. Others are undertrimmed, like the RCZ or Mito, two of the cases where the choices presented are just average or entry level trims when the far more interesting top of the line cars like the RCZR or QV were available even at the time when those two cars were modelled in GT5 and 6.

GT7 is really about car collecting and you feel like a collector. Some of tha cars are bought in the regular dealership, other cars in the used section and others in the legendary dealership. The legendary leadership is for the rarer cars. 

As for forza  it offers 20 tracks with 36 layouts and over 500 cars. 

Content wise, lots of tracks are missing, like Brands Hatch, Monza, Nordschleife that comes later on, Imola, Road America but also Alps, Rio or Prague. The track list isnt expansive in the least. Car selection is generally OK as it covers most of the most popular brands and models, all the way from entry level econoboxes to modern supercars. Rarer cars from the Euro or Japanese market also appear in the coices. 

Still, both of them have a good selection. Plyphony has offered increased content, normally cars, over the course of the almost 2 years it has been out. Every update will deliver free content. DLCs should be rare. Forza is fairly new, so in terms of content it hasnt really expanded yet. At the time of writing, the new Yas Marina will be on update 2, still, the brunt of new content should be offered via season packs or DLCs. 

We have to talk obviously about a center part of the games which is customization. Forza has always been the standard for this, and to be fair it is slightly ahead. All cars can be tuned, customised and have their engines and drive trains swapped. This can mean some cars can be made absolute monsters.

Gran Turismo has definitely shortened the gap. The car customization and tuning is comprehensive, as well is now possible to change engines, provided you get to level 50 in the game. Some of the swaps are natural, others are absolutely insane. A K20 in a Honda Beat? Lets goooooo

So, the talk about content will lead to the next , very important point, a contentious one at that. So, graphics wise, for me Gran Turismo is unbeatable at the moment, no matter the platform. 

Polyphony delivers a graphical product that encompasses every single little detail. The interior of cars is extremely well designed. The textiles, the choice upholstery, everything is to the point. The outside of cars has the same level of care as well, one look at the headlights and youll see the reflective patterned being extremely well represented. These patterns are not just textures. The same level of care is shown in the tracks too.

The detail is absolutely phenomenal in real life tracks. The elevations, tree coverage, moving spectators and background traffic, all give a sense of immersion, that the track is alive.

The details also transfer to the fantasy original tracks. There are next gen tracks that came from Sport, these received mild updates for 7. The revamped older tracks like Trial Mountain or the newly added Grand Valley are extremely different from their predecessors. The layout has changed, even the scenery has changed in the case of Grand Valley.

For Forza Looks are bipolar. It can have beautiful scenes where the light looks better than gran turismo, then 2 seconds later, the image becomes crunched, contrasty and a mess. Forza Horizon in the other hand looks absolutely stunning 100% of the time. 

I know its a different studio and such, but such a massive difference isnt really explainable. 

This doesnt get better with car models. Turn10 took a page out of Polyphony in Gran Turismo 5 and 6 with the GT4 models and decided to use Forza 4 models in 2023. So the interiors will feel jagged, the material shaders arent good, making the game feel dated. Outside, even with the newer models, the paint quality, reflections the way the light works feels like Im racing 2 generations ago. Once again, Im all for older racing titles, but this is AAA title with AAA prices.

Track models arent that much better. The track models not only feel dated but they feel they arent accurate at all. I know they say the track models are laser scanned, but I see issues. All other titles that are laser scanned have essentially the same track. Same elevations, and minute differences in sudden track depressions, but the way the track is, is exactly the same. 

Take Spa for example. Its pre Eau rouge change, then the scale feels absurdly off. Its not FOV (which is changeable by the way), but side by side with ACC or Gran Turismo, something is off in all the real world tracks. 

For Forza to look good, it needs everything to be aligned. Gran Turismo looks good almost 100% of the time. 

As for performance, generally Gran Turismo does 4K60 in raytracing mode all the time. It does have a performance mode as well. At 1080p it will never stutter, theres a 1440p VRR mode that will target 120hz when possible. At 4K60 I did have a couple of hiccups, just momentarily. This means the performance is rock solid. 

As for Forza, big problems in all platforms. In the PC its an absolute mess at the moment and will take time to get sorted. It doesnt matter with or without raytracing, graphics card or CPU. It will stutter, and even with beefy setups getting over 72fps is difficult. 

Now for the biggest contention point of all: Driving and physics. This are driving games made to be enjoyed by a vast array of drivers, in different setups, from gamepads, to last generation direct drives and everything in between. Where it mostly matters, in the point, I will give this a draw, not as a cop-out, but because the two directions these teams have chosen for these games shine really well. 

Lets start with Gran Turismo. Its driving its all about finesse, keeping in the inputs in line, dont do any sudden changes of steering. It has some sensitivity to large inputs in the wheel or pedals. The cars need to stay inside the tyre slip angle as going past it it will induce a lot of sliding around. In this case, Gran Turismo teaches a lot of car control because thats the way to drive the car. The physics are still extremely relatable and drive as you would expect these cars to drive, no matter where the wheel drive is or the engine layout. There are a few interesting nuggets about all wheel drive cars. Depending of the engine layout, transversal vs longitudinal, in GT7 transversal all wheel drives like subarus will feel extremely understeery like a front wheel driven car with a bit of rear traction. Nissan Skylines are more to the rear with a bit front assistance. This is probably the title that makes it feel these technicalities more in the front. Forza doesnt have this nuance set so prevalently. Assetto Corsa requires some modded cars or physics to have something like this.

Generally, the physics work well, the bumps, suspension, aero loads and so on.

Forza also drives really well, but theres something to be said about the stock setups in cars. Those will make the driving a little bit on the awkward side until tyre pressures and suspension settings are changed. For suspension settings, it may require suspension upgrades. I think generally the handling is well done. Cars handle how they are supposed to, as in the power, acceleration, general handling derived from car layout. The handling model lacks some finesse. Modern cars, racing cars even, always seem on edge when they should be planted even with stock suspension and  tyres. Im not going to say it drives bad, what I want to say is that compared to the eternal rival, it lacks some of its clinical details in the driving mechanics, making the handling too out there some of the time. With just a little bit of extra power, every car is a driftr machine or handles like a muscle car. It needs a little tone down. It needs to be grounded. If it had a little more of that clinical nature of Gran Turismo without going all out that way, this new Forza would have something fantastic here, as the tyre model is actually pretty easy to understand where the grip is and even how much grip is there. It has this progressive feel without a sudden cliff. Its natural and believable. 

The forcefeedback is also another topic. Gran Turismo 7 at launch had horrible ffb, but over a year later its far more developed. All the feeling is there now. On the DD1 which Ive used more recently, affiliat links in the description tyo help the channel out, it does feel now super connected and planted. The limits of adherence are felt easily. I still need to check drifting after 1.4 because the forcefeedback refresh rate at high speed movements, especially after the slip angle of the tyre was muted no matter the forcefeedback settings. 

As for Forza, the stock settings arent good at all. The Default settings have a huge deadzone ingrained that needs to  be removed. Its only 1% in game but thats already too much.The stock settings are very strangel, you really need to go through the list if you are using a wheel. When tuned, it finally has connection to the road, the feel is there, understeer, oversteer, slip angle, tyres bending, kerbs and so  on. This was tested on a DD1 and on a Asetek Forte. I wasnt expecting the forte to work so well, but it absolutely does. Remember to save the settings into a profile because for starters this game forgets settings and then also forgets what profile you had the settings in.  

For the handling we need to talk about the rain driving and the rain in general. Here I think Gran Turismo has some of the best dynamic weather out there. The weather develops in a way that is totally natural on the track. What I like about it is that the puddles will develop as the weather comes in, but even if the sun comes and the track dries, the puddles will stay. Graphically it is impeccable.The rain driving is challenging and believable. Youll have to go over the wet or dry line depending on the tyre and state of track. Aquaplanning can happen and driving in the rain is as youd expect. 

Forza has more simplified weather and went for a more dramatic look.Well except as the rain falls in the windscreen. It looks horrible. The rain driving is OK, nothing to write home about. The dynamic track isnt much dynamic, more like Assetto Corsa Comeptizione as the track develops in particularly scripted ways. In terms of driving it feels ok, its more like a low grip sheen.

Regardless, both titles have tyre compounds to adust to different stages of the race, giving strategy to the races where we can bet if the weather is going to improve, or betting that the worse compound wont lose that much time.

Singleplayer is a big component of these titles, hence the effort to get all of those missions and series. Therefore youll have to play against AI. Its here the comparisons become interesting between titles. Currently, Gran Turismo has 2 modes of AI, the regular one, and a new one called Sophy. The regular AI is tremendously basic to say the least. They do a conga line and thats about it. Same since launch.

Sophy is the “advanced AI”. The current state of Sophy is very barebones, but still very interesting. Sophy reacts to the player, formulates defense lines, loitering, tries to attack, reacts to other AI. Its reactive, its proactive. Sadly, its still severely limited, as only 9 tracks are supported, not all cars are compatible and it doesnt seem to scale with car tuning options. The difficulty options are as well very limited. 3 difficulty options, they come with fixed race lenghts as well. As this AI is based on reinforcement techniques, its likely that in the future Sophy will expand its repertoire, but currently while good, its limited.

Forza AI needs work. Difficulty wise I dont find them that difficult, some tracks seem to give a better skill rating to the AI than others. You can change the difficulty of the AI, gain the bonuses and such. The problem is sharing the track with the AI. Its good that they arent the moving traffic cones that normally are associated with both games. Its also good that the race format that they allow isnt the same old “can I do first to last challenge”. The problem arises at trying to race side by side, from behind, or from the front. Turn 1 is always a mess, if you arent getting pushed round by the AI, the AI will have no problems pushing the other AI around for good old vehicular murder. To be far it dont dislike it, I think it has a place in racing, wreckfest or otherwise. In places, at club level, aggressive dirty drivers exist.Often times their racing skill drops to the bottom where they fail to understand a racing line or even where to brake. Its extremely coming to go through an apex at speed just to understand that the AI decided to stop in front of us. 

The last few years in racing games brought multiplayer into center stage. The two titles couldnt be more different about it even if at a glance, they are similar. 

Gran Turismo has two main modes, one called sport and the lobby mode. Theres split screen but thats for local multiplayer. 

 In the sport mode, there will be the regular daily racing, once in a while the granturismo nationcup qualifiers, and something to get a few credits from, timetrials. 

The sport races will tier every driver against each other on a quasi-on-demand system ,for races that can be joined almost immediately.

Sports matchmaking system rates individual drivers based on performance and safety. both ratings go from the worst, D to the best S and will pair each driver with a split that matches 

their rating.Sport mode doesnt have a traditional qualify setting, you can gring the qualify time for the week and then you are matched to a race based on your skill and safety rating, but your starting position will be based oin your qualify time.

As for the racing there are admittedly many ups and downs. Drivers can be overly aggressive in committing to extreme manouvers like hairpins with 3 or even 4 wide are not uncommon and of course crashes happen often due to these situations and others as similar. Penalties are a very bad state as of this moment. Its not uncommon to have certain drivers abuse of the penalty system to commit on road murder, get away with it and having the victim slapped with a penalty. Regardless, its mostly due to safety rating, as these issue reduces substantially in S rating. In a good split there will be good racing. Penalties really need to improve. 

Lobby mode is where the old gran turismo multiplayer survives with more community driven events with races, drag races, drifting and so on.

As For Forza The lobby system is not really global, like iracing, assetto corsa competizione low fuel motorsports or gt 7, where the player is bun  ched up in a pool, sorted by rating and then inserted in a server with closely matched drivers. Its more instanced and the servers will fill up as people sign due to the structure of the multiplayer. 

This structure is where the multiplayer becomes super enjoyable for me as it is closer to the titles I play most times. We are dropped into a session where much like single player, we can practice. Setups can be changed, tyre compounds can be played with, do a few laps to test tyre degradation, setup and so on. There may be variable weather adding another layer of complexity to the system. The qualify is also more traditional, a mix between Assetto Corsa Competizione and iracing, where you have 3 laps to set your best time, while the other players share the track with you, but they will be ghosts in the track.. 

Going into the race we are met with Forza staples. One Ive mentioned in the review, which is that the driving is fundamentally extremely good. The driving is easy to understand and drive with but challenging enough to provide a ceiling and a relation to what is expected of the cars being driven. The TCR racing is so much fun. The cars are extremely fun to throw around, they are pushed side to side by others. The racing is extremely close, almost like being in one of those Touring Car videos from the 90s. In the GTs or any faster classes it will be more spaced out like it happens everywhere else. 

Another staple of Forza will be the Forza drivers. We have all seen the videos of crashers, rammers, low lifes and the such. These drivers exist in the new Forza Motorsports, Ive dealt with a few, but I can say that they arent a constant issue in my opinion. Theres a couple of them every so often and thats about it. As for the remaining drivers, theres plenty of types, the clueless ones, the overcommitted, the gentledriver and the fast as heck. The fill as you go format of the lobby where we are thrown to race creates a bigger skill gap between drivers, in my experience. As long as they qualify for the safety rating, the lobbies will be filled with a bigger gap of driver rating, which then results in qualify times that can be quite substantial. 

A lower skilled or safety rating lobby  may cause a bunch of racing issues, so as always, your mileage may vary. 

But overall, my experience with the lobbies and the online driving has been extremely positive. 

There is a penalty system that can be gamed, and forza really needs a Car radar, as the arrows arent really that good. 

Gran Turismo went for the get racing faster approach, 

To conclude, I think its obvious from this video that my opinion is the better title as of this moment, or at the very least in a better state. In terms of gameplay mechanics, systems in place, stability of the game, options, multiplayer and so forth, gran turismo is a more complete, a better thought through product. This is not to say that Forza doesnt have value or anything, because as youve probably seen in streams and videos I enjoy the driving and multiplayer of Forza immensely, and I appreciate the multiplayer format it gives us, but sadly the skill difference is way too much at the time. Still, forza in its launch its a severely worse state than Gran Turismo and Gran Turismo was already a mess, I think we can agree on that. 

Forza still has a long way to go. Gran Turismo is a far more mature product, and honestly, for me, it looks better, and has more to enjoy. 

Let me know your opinions below.